Hello,
this is Kylie Cochran and Emma
and Emma Vandennedi interviewing Doctor Rachel Fettick
on December 4th at 1:30 p.m. in the Barrett Suite.
This interview is part of the Barrett Oral History Project.
Our goal is to preserve a record of
Barrett's history in honor of our 30th anniversary.
Thank you so much for taking the time to sit down with us and share your experience.
No,
thank you.
So we're just gonna get started with some introductory questions.
So the first question I have for you is,
can you describe your personal history with Barrett?
So I guess it begins,
uh,
some time ago,
uh,
far,
far in the,
in the past.
Um,
I was a student at Barrett,
um,
and so I,
and I was actually a,
a transfer student in,
into Barrett,
uh.
In uh my
career at at ASU.
So that's when it began,
and then I mean,
it's come around to to now where I'm now,
I now have the wonderful opportunity to,
to teach here.
Why did you decide you wanted to work for Barrett?
So
to say one decides to work somewhere in academia would be a bit of a stretch
because
job opportunities are,
are,
are very,
very limited.
But when I learned of the opportunity to work for Barrett,
I was so,
so excited.
And I mean,
one of the reasons I was so excited,
uh,
and thrilled to learn about that opportunity was because of how,
how much I enjoyed my experience at Barrett and
particularly my experience in
the human event in Barrett classes and just knowing that there was was,
uh,
a lot,
uh,
there were smaller class sizes and there's a lot more,
uh,
interaction with students and the classes were all discussion based,
uh,
because my previous teaching experience tended to be
with really big classes and I mean,
that's,
uh,
you know,
different and.
Uh,
fun experience in a different way.
However,
uh,
I really wanted to have a chance to kind of develop more relationships,
you know,
more academic relationships with students,
and,
and I think those discussion settings really,
uh,
really facilitate that rather than
kind of being,
uh,
I mean,
when one has literally hundreds of students a semester,
the
students get kind of lost in,
in the crowd.
So it's nice.
To get to know each and every student individually and kind of watch them grow
throughout the year and hopefully throughout their college career as well.
How many years have you been working for Barrett?
This,
I have completed 3 years and I'm going into my 4th year.
So I guess I'm about,
well,
once the semester's over,
halfway
done with my 4th year.
So did any
particular undergraduate experience influence how you teach here at Barrett?
Oh,
an undergrad experience influencing how
I teach,
but uh.
I guess,
yeah,
I,
I guess I can't really,
in fairness,
say anything in my undergrad influence kind of my teaching,
that's
certainly come
through
more of
My teaching experience through through my
graduate through my graduate program and um
and other teaching jobs I've had,
OK.
What has changed since you first started working here?
Uh,
so much,
a lot.
So,
but I mean,
some things,
the,
the core of Barrett,
uh,
certainly remains the same.
I mean,
it's expanded immensely.
So when I was a student at Barrett,
well,
Barrett only existed in Tempe,
and,
well,
I mean,
the downtown campus didn't exist at all,
either did Polly,
and I mean,
there was no residents.
Complex,
uh,
it was an Irish Hall.
I don't even know if,
I think that might still exist on ASU's campus.
I don't know.
But so it was it was a very,
very small community.
And they're just,
and I mean,
also,
I think given kind of the time and
the fact that it was so small,
well,
also,
I tended to be a student that kind of just like minded my
own business and did my work and so I was not aware of.
Uh,
really programming or opportunity engagements.
I
I maybe I wasn't,
I disengaged,
but,
but I mean that there's so many opportunities now for
students to get involved in so many different things,
um,
be it,
yeah,
service or just a fun activity or self-care.
There's so many different,
uh,
opportunities,
internships,
so that's certainly changed,
um.
Quite,
quite a lot,
the immense growth,
but in terms of the education,
I think that's really
the same because I still really quite clearly
remember what my human event classes were like,
and they were fantastic.
Uh,
and so I think the,
the,
the spirit of those classes has remained the same over many,
many years.
From me being a student to now me,
me teaching here,
uh,
so I think that,
yeah,
that classroom experience is,
is very much the same.
And also,
and,
uh,
Barrett did at that time still have a have a strong study abroad program,
and
I was lucky enough to participate that in as an undergrad.
So I think that certainly continued over over the years.
Where did you go?
I,
uh,
when I went,
I,
it was a,
um,
We went to 3 cities and the the trip length was longer because,
well,
just,
you know,
costs have changed over the years,
I think we spent 3 weeks in London.
Uh
Two weeks in Edinburgh and a week in Dublin,
I might,
I probably have that off somehow,
but I want to say it was about 5 or 6 weeks,
um,
in,
yeah,
in the UK region in Ireland,
so
yeah,
that sounds like it was an awesome experience.
Oh,
it was,
it,
yeah,
it was,
it was really,
it was really amazing,
it was the perfect integration.
Uh,
yeah,
academics and experiencing the culture and it was,
it was a lot,
a lot of fun,
and I,
I made lifelong friends in that,
in that program,
even though I usually just
kept down and
didn't really
socialize that much.
That was that program definitely,
yeah,
expanded my social horizons just to establish a timetable.
I know this is like kind of a taboo question,
but when were you in
Barrett?
Oh,
I suppose I can say I know
so.
Well,
since I was a transfer student,
technically,
I didn't start in Barrett until 2000.
Um,
2000,
2003.
That was not that long ago.
So in your past 3 years working for Barrett,
have you worked on any past special projects through the Barrett program?
Um,
let's see here.
So,
I mean,
I have been,
uh,
involved with the Center for the Study of Race and Democracy,
uh,
pretty regularly.
So I,
I attend their events and,
uh,
volunteer at their events,
encourage my students to go to their
events,
uh,
and sometimes participate,
uh,
as,
as a panelist.
So that's,
um,
I'm certainly passionate about,
uh,
about the CSRD and the work,
the work they do.
Uh,
but I've also more recently started working on,
uh,
establishing an Inside Out prison exchange program,
uh,
for,
uh,
for Barrett.
So there's already a program running
currently incriminology and criminal justice,
uh,
but I wanted to start a Barrett,
uh,
specific class,
so,
uh,
that I'm going to be teaching my first class,
um,
in,
in the spring
with,
uh,
with that model,
and the,
the program.
Uh,
is a program that started in 1997,
initially by a professor Laurie Pompa at Temple University,
and the,
the idea behind this program is to bring,
uh,
quote,
inside students,
uh,
you know,
incarcerated persons
and quote,
outside students,
traditional college students into the same classroom.
So,
uh,
so it's a really unique experience where people from
immensely diverse backgrounds can get together and
You know,
think about
the world's problems,
so I think it's uh a really amazing opportunity for
kind of both sets of students to,
uh,
Transform themselves and transform the world,
the world around them,
so I'm really excited to get that class going.
What do you hope Barrett students specifically gain from a program such as this,
um.
This is gonna sound very lofty,
but I hope it changes their life.
I hope it gives them
a perspective that they've,
they
just couldn't have imagined before in learning about,
uh,
you know,
different people's different life experiences and also exploring
the specific kind of topics in the class that
we'll be exploring.
Um,
so the,
the course is men and feminism,
and so,
um,
I think when,
of course,
when people think of feminism,
people think about equality and liberating women,
but in this course,
I actually want to focus upon
How feminism,
uh,
liberates men as well,
that men are also oppressed by the patriarchy,
and that's
the main focus of the course.
So really questioning gender norms that
are really harmful to men,
uh,
thinking about what it means to be a man,
and usually that means
being tough and not being emotional and cutting oneself off from emotion,
and
that usually means,
uh,
objectifying women as a demonstration of power or
Uh,
being rich or things like that and how that's actually really,
really harmful to men,
and,
but also thinking about how feminism
could be a solution
to,
uh,
to that,
that oppression for,
for men as well.
Where did your inspiration for this particular subject matter come from?
Oh,
gosh,
yeah,
I guess.
I mean,
I've had a lot of,
I've just had a lot of interest in
various social,
uh,
social justice issues
for,
um,
for a long time.
That's a really good question.
I'm gonna have to ponder that for,
for a moment,
um.
So,
and
I mean,
I think we've all,
I mean,
everyone has experienced harm in some way or another.
And I think thinking about,
um,
maybe some of my own experiences of harm
and
thinking about maybe men in my life that may have
demonstrated that it when I've
over reflecting on this for years,
it really seems to me that
A large,
uh,
a large reason that I think men cause harm is due
to these really oppressive gender norms that they internalize and then,
and then demonstrate.
So,
uh,
so,
I mean,
so I've also been passionate about feminism,
uh,
and,
but,
I mean,
I want to liberate men from these oppressive structures,
but that also is in turn going to help
women,
like if,
if men aren't internalizing these
Uh,
these harmful stereotypes,
then,
uh,
they're also not going to be harming women then as a,
as a result of that.
So I think it all kind of works.
I think all of it has to be addressed,
and we can't just focus on
Liberating women or liberating men,
it's kind of all has to work,
work together.
Have you established a book list for that class yet?
Like,
what materials would you be looking at?
Yes,
so,
oh,
handy dandy syllabus.
I'm just
questioning because I know,
um,
Adichie wrote a really good letter about feminism.
I don't know if you've heard it.
Like I'm sorry,
the,
uh,
Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie
wrote the book called Dear EJ Wale,
or 15 familiar,
yeah,
uh,
yeah,
I've heard of that,
but unfortunately,
yeah,
I.
I have not
made that made it to that on my book,
my book reading list.
Well,
I highly recommend it.
I'm just curious what,
uh,
what,
what like,
uh,
sources you're consulting for the class.
So,
uh,
we'll certainly be looking at,
uh,
a number of Bell Hooks works.
Uh,
so we'll be starting with Feminism is for Everybody,
and then,
uh,
looking at some selections from her book Communion,
and then also reading her book The Will to Change.
So those are the central
feminist works I'm going to be drawing from.
And then,
but we'll also be looking at documentaries,
so,
uh,
we'll be looking at the feminist in Cellblock Y,
and that's actually a documentary about uh a prison class that teaches feminism.
Uh,
so,
and it's almost exactly
what I want to do in my class,
so it works
quite nicely with this class.
Uh,
also,
we're gonna watch like The Mask You Live in,
Misrepresentation,
uh,
to kind of look at some of those issues.
Uh,
what are some of the other
Well,
also looking at some articles on different.
Um,
the way masculinity can be problematic in kind of different types of ways,
depending on like,
uh,
ethnicity,
so Chicano manhood might be different
from black masculinity,
and we'll be examining,
uh,
kind of some of those differences
as well,
but we'll also be getting into
Uh,
into
some work on,
on rape culture and how that ties in
to,
um,
to the violence,
I think that just comes from these,
uh,
these stereotypes,
uh,
these oppressive stereotypes that men are kind of forced to,
to adopt in society,
so.
I mean,
I could go on and on.
I don't know how,
I don't know how many sources you want,
but no,
my next question about this program is
this the first semester that Barrett is partnering
with?
OK,
yeah,
so that,
yeah,
this spring will be the first,
yeah,
the first class happening.
And is it just going to be a one semester class you're going to see how it.
I,
I suppose that's fair to say.
I mean,
my,
my hope is certainly to continue this.
Uh,
I,
I would love to do it once a year.
Logistically,
that might be difficult,
uh,
but I really hope we could do this class every,
every other year
to give Bera students that,
that opportunity.
OK,
now moving on to another very important class,
the human event.
So can you talk a little bit about your teaching
style and your approach to the human event class.
So,
well,
I guess
I first start out maybe with the commonalities,
but,
um,
I mean,
I really see the human events as a multicultural historical survey
of
various humanities,
so exploring philosophy,
literature,
poetry,
art,
religion.
Uh,
history
and,
uh,
exploring all of these,
uh,
kind of different genres
through various texts,
but,
uh,
I certainly,
I,
I looked,
of course,
at written texts,
but also film,
as well as documentaries and music videos,
uh,
that I'll often,
and sometimes I'll,
I often will pair a music video with a text to kind of draw
connections with that.
So,
Um.
I think I just totally lost my train of thought.
What was the question again?
I was just asking about how you approach the human event course because it is,
it is such a diverse course and every teacher has their own
take on what the human event should be,
um,
so
I mean,
I think,
I really think I approach it more as a
facilitator.
So,
I like to,
of course,
I'm there to guide the discussion and set the parameters
and clarify things if there's confusion along the way
and make any corrections that may be necessary,
but I really see the,
uh,
the class as
largely led by the students.
It's really a student,
uh,
student-driven discussion.
And,
uh,
In terms,
uh,
I guess also in terms of my approach,
since my background's in philosophy,
I mean,
that's the lens in which I kind of see everything through.
And also,
uh,
having background,
uh,
within philosophy,
studying a lot of feminist philosophy,
those are just some of the issues that tend to
pop out at me more often than than others.
So,
uh,
so that might be a like slightly different way I might approach the,
the human event than others.
I might have more Beyonce videos.
I taught a Beyonce class,
so
sounds like a fun class.
So besides your philosophy background and feminist background,
what other expertise areas do you say you bring to your human event course?
So,
I'm also
working
on,
uh,
actually a couple books right now on love.
So I always try to push those questions in the human event,
particularly,
uh,
the possible
tensions or intersections between love and justice.
So,
Uh,
that I think in different texts bring that out,
I think in different ways.
So thinking about whether
love is,
uh,
love can be just,
or whether love requires justice,
or maybe love and justice are just two different realms that can't intersect.
So,
uh,
so those are,
uh,
philosophical questions I'm interested in that I certainly bring,
bring to,
uh,
to the human event.
But also,
I think just,
I,
I often bring,
especially in
like 272.
Oh,
a lot of social issues about class and and race and.
And LGBTQ
issues and so we kind of explore a lot of,
a lot of that kind of
social,
social issues.
For the sake of this interview,
can you explain 172 and 272 just for historical context?
Oh,
OK,
so yeah,
170.
One starts from,
well,
kind of the beginning of time whenever the professor wants to start,
and uh
it's,
it ends,
I
think,
in 1600 and then 272 picks up from 1600 through
modern modern times.
So that's it,
so that's the,
the really only formal distinction between the two is these
these dates.
So,
looking at both of your semesters,
do you have a favorite text?
I would have to say,
I mean,
that's hard,
but I,
I thought about this for a while.
I think Moonlight might be my favorite text,
of course,
that's a film,
uh,
but that's,
I think that might be
my,
my favorite text,
because it brings together so many of these issues that I care about in one film,
and it's just a beautiful,
breathtaking film for one thing,
the acting is
completely impeccable,
and
it brings together uh issues about
Uh,
oppressive conceptions of masculinity.
It brings together LGBTQ issues,
uh,
issues of race and class and,
uh,
oppression and incarceration.
It just,
it kind of,
yeah,
it brings together all,
all the important issues in my mind,
and it does so,
yeah,
in a,
in a beautiful,
in a beautiful way.
So
I think that would have to be my favorite,
and the students certainly get a lot out of it too.
It's kind of nice.
I talk about a lot of these issues separately,
and then the students can also,
I think,
get get a lot out of talking about all these issues brought into one film.
I was also gonna ask what in your experience
has been the student's' favorite text from your course?
That's a good
question.
Or a popular one that comes to mind.
Yeah,
I'd have,
I,
I can never remember what I assign.
I seriously have to,
I mean,
well.
I,
I think.
I for 171,
I recently assigned Lieutenant Nunn,
and that seemed to be very popular,
and this is the first time,
yeah,
that I've,
I've assigned it,
and the students really seem to,
to,
to enjoy that text.
It's and the text is about,
uh,
I'm actually not sure how to
Talk about
uh Catalina's gender because Catalina,
uh,
biologically is female,
but then lived as a male
most of their life,
but
also sometimes in writing refer to themselves as a woman,
but sometimes a man,
so I'm not sure how to refer to Catalina,
but it's the,
the Catalina's story is that
Uh,
well,
at the time,
she was in a convent and she hated it there,
so she broke out when she was a teenager and lived
as a man for pretty much the rest of her life,
and this is during
uh the period during colonialism,
so she went to the quote,
New World and
participated in all of those horrific acts,
but it's
just quite a fascinating story that,
you know,
that,
um,
Someone was able,
uh,
able to do that.
So the,
the students certainly were,
uh,
I think,
uh,
really engaged in,
in that text and the different issues it brought about in terms of
gender identity,
but also colonialism and violence and yet bringing about questions,
yeah,
what does it mean to be a man,
what does it mean to be a woman,
so
that was really popular,
um.
And actually,
yeah,
I just finished up history of ideas and.
I think a lot of the students liked some selections
from uh a poetry collection,
Red Hot Salsa,
from,
and that's a collection of
uh Latinx,
Chicanx um
uh writers,
and
yeah,
and it really brings together kind of uh a
lot of the poetry focuses on struggles with identity.
And,
well,
I think that's
I would imagine,
well,
I mean,
when I was that age,
I mean,
I think struggles with identity are pretty common,
uh,
in one's college years.
So I kind of like to
push that.
It's like think about this more,
and
in that in that text collection,
the identities are primarily struggles with,
you know,
one's American identity versus one's
Mexican identity or Dominican identity and how those can be intentioned.
Uh,
with one another,
or,
but also how they can,
can come together and be unified.
So that's,
I think those were also some popular texts too.
What's the biggest
takeaway that you want your students to walk away from at the end
of April?
Oh,
I want them
to question everything.
I don't want them to take anything for face value.
Uh,
I think the most important thing in the,
in the human event is coming away
with
those honed critical thinking skills.
That's what I really want them to take away.
I mean,
it would be nice if they can,
it's nice if one remembers like something they read,
like,
but,
but I mean that that the critical thinking skills are what.
Or what everyone needs.
I mean,
it doesn't matter what
path you're going on,
everyone needs those critical thinking skills.
So,
so that would be the biggest takeaway I'd hope my students,
uh,
my students have.
Looking back on when you took the Barrett class,
how has it been different teaching it,
and would there be anything you would have told yourself
as
a first year Barrett student?
Oh gosh,
hm.
So I might not be
following the question.
Oh,
because you are,
well,
you were a transfer student.
So
I guess what I'm trying to ask is,
now that you've been teaching the course and now that you
see the other side of the intent of the human event,
what would you have told yourself when you were taking
that class that maybe would have answered your questions about
what the human event is or how do I approach such a discussion-based class.
Not like
Let me think.
I mean,
I think that idea was pretty clearly presented when I took the human event anyway,
so I don't know if I'd really have to tell my tell myself to do that because I think
that
that was really,
really pushed by the professors that I have,
that it's really about critical thinking,
and so
we should be analyzing,
analyzing
these texts in a deep and significant way and
think about them in different ways and play,
play with ideas,
and I think that's
What I,
I,
what I tried to do anyway in the course,
so.
So now bringing it back to the present.
Can you describe kind of a day in your life you're at work,
you're working for Barrett in addition to your
outside programs that you're working on?
Yeah,
that
every day is so different,
but so it's really hard to say,
but
um,
let me
see here.
So,
yeah,
every day is quite a bit different,
but,
um,
I mean,
of course,
like I may be teaching class
one day.
Most days I'm meeting with students uh to to talk about,
uh,
to talk about ideas in the class or to talk about their papers,
or I'm meeting with thesis students that I'm working with.
Uh,
you know,
I might be attending,
uh,
a CSRD event or a Barrett lecture or something like that.
Uh,
as I talked about the Inside Out program,
there's a lot of organization and kind of,
uh,
administrative details to take care of with that,
so I'm often working on that,
communicating with,
with people,
uh.
Also,
of course,
there's just,
there's grading,
there are admin there's administrative stuff,
uh,
and also
I also work,
uh,
with the,
the travel program,
and I'm also participating in one of the travel programs this summer.
So,
so that also certainly,
uh,
takes up some,
some time too,
which is a lot of fun,
aren't you going to.
Australia,
is that true?
Uh,
Germany and Switzerland.
Can you talk a little bit about this program as well?
Oh,
yeah,
sure.
So,
uh,
I am going along with Dr.
Fetti,
who designed this program,
uh,
Finding Frankenstein.
So it's going to be awesome and amazing.
I may be a little biased,
but
It's,
we're going,
well,
there's so many things I like about this program.
Well,
for one thing,
I mean,
Germany and Switzerland are just amazing,
but we're going to actually be going to some more,
some more of the,
the smaller towns,
uh,
so we can be more immersed in the culture there,
because when you go to a big city,
so if you go to a tourist trap,
sometimes 1 may not even really feel like there's
somewhere that different than,
uh,
a place in the US,
but
Uh,
and also,
I mean,
as the theme is Finding Frankenstein,
we'll be visiting
significant places from,
from the novel Frankenstein.
So,
uh,
we'll be going to Frankenstein's castle,
uh,
we'll be going to the,
the glacier in France,
the,
the cave.
There's so many,
there's so many places we'll be going.
I can't,
I can't remember them all off the top of my head,
but
it's,
yeah,
it's super exciting.
And then the class I'm teaching,
uh,
well.
So it may sound
far off,
but
Um,
but in Frankenstein,
there's a lot of complex identities,
so I'm actually kind of taking that idea
and,
uh,
bridging it with
Switzerland,
which I think has a complex identity,
uh,
it having at least 4 or is it 5 languages
common in the country,
and so my class is focusing on Anne-Marie Schwarzenbach,
who
is not a well-known figure in the US but has kind of a cult following in,
in Switzerland,
and I'm going to be talking about uh her complex identity.
In
multiple levels,
so kind of,
I want to say,
sort of mirrors Switzerland's complex identity,
also like Switzerland being neutral in the war and what in World War II,
but what does that really mean?
Um,
and then
Anne-Marie Schwarzenbach,
she,
uh,
actually she was kind of growing up,
uh,
at,
she was a young adult when World War II was breaking out,
and her parents were supporting the fascists and she was
Strongly opposed to to that movement,
and she was actually a journalist,
a photojournalist and a writer,
and traveled all over the world writing stories and taking pictures.
So,
uh,
so she certainly had kind of maybe multiple
identities in terms of
kind of how,
how much she traveled,
but also
she,
uh,
she dressed,
she started dressing as a boy,
uh,
like a boy,
quote,
uh,
when she was a young child.
Child,
and I guess all just kind of always
dressed like that uh throughout throughout her life.
So,
and
uh
she had relationships with both men and women,
so she had kind of multiple layers of a complex,
complex identity.
So
that's how I'm kind of tying it in with the Finding Frankenstein,
since Frankenstein,
the characters in Frankenstein have a complex identity.
This is another kind of branch,
branch of that.
So when you're coming up with this course,
what is your first step
when you're given this opportunity?
Uh,
well,
So
I guess it was.
It was,
I mean,
this totally just draws from my own lucky
experience.
So I only know about Anne Marie Schwartzenbach because uh my thesis advisor
is
her,
my dissertation advisor is a relative of hers,
but also studies her
and is writing a book on her,
uh,
she's become kind of more popular
in the years in Switzerland,
so,
yeah,
she's,
she's Swiss,
so it's just kind of
Dumb luck,
if you will,
that like when uh when Doctor Fetty proposed this course and was asking for,
you know,
courses to be paired along with it,
I thought,
huh,
maybe,
maybe that,
maybe that could work and well,
it did,
so.
Do you have a particular mentor in Barrett or anyone
that you've worked with that's really stood out to you?
Oh gosh,
there's so many.
Goodness,
goodness,
you can name a few,
yeah,
so,
so
Barrett is.
I cannot emphasize enough how incredibly amazing Barrett is
in providing mentors to one another when first starting to teach here,
because,
I mean,
it's,
I mean,
to be frank,
it's a pretty tough job in terms of,
because none of us
were teaching texts
as I was.
Talking about earlier from all different disciplines,
and we are not,
we are,
we don't have PhDs and,
you know,
we don't have,
we all don't have like 6 different PhDs.
So
we need to kind of in,
uh,
you know,
designing
effective discussion questions and things.
It's,
I think it's,
it's a lot to take on teaching job.
Uh,
but I think that
luckily,
Barrett understands that and we get so much support from our fellow colleagues.
Uh,
we actually have a mentoring program,
so new,
uh,
new faculty get paired up and matched up
with,
uh,
more experienced faculty,
uh,
and actually the faculty members,
I guess just that I
work with most,
who I was assigned to,
uh,
were Doctor O'Flaherty and Doctor Scott,
so they've been incredibly helpful in
helping me.
Uh,
kind of figure out how this whole human event thing
works
and the best ways to navigate it.
I mean,
but again,
like so many people have been so helpful with like little things here and there.
It's what I have to just say like everybody,
but
I've worked mostly with,
with them.
Now,
when you took Barrett,
does your Barrett teacher still work for Barrett,
or do you,
do you?
Yeah,
uh,
yes,
so,
well,
actually the human event,
no,
they are not,
they aren't,
uh,
at Barrett anymore,
but when I,
uh,
attended study abroad,
yeah,
22 of those professors are still here.
So
yeah,
it's,
yeah,
pretty fun.
So my next,
my next question for you is,
what makes Barrett downtown since you took classes at Tempe different
from.
Your previous experience with Barrett.
Yeah,
so,
uh,
Barrett Downtown is,
yeah,
I think really unique,
well,
for a number of reasons.
I mean,
well,
we're literally embedded in the downtown community.
Uh,
well,
for one thing,
it's in an urban environment,
which the other
campuses are not,
and,
but,
and,
and also we're not.
Uh,
Barrett downtown is not like sequestered off.
It's not separated from downtown.
It's completely,
I mean,
it's,
you just kind of,
it looks like another,
you know,
downtown building.
It's just completely integrated into the city.
So,
uh,
So I,
I really like that feel,
uh,
feeling integrated in the community and,
and the city,
and I think,
and it also provides them amazing resources just right outside our doorstep.
So,
having,
for instance,
like news stations right around the corner for journalism majors and,
I mean,
all the courthouses are right down here,
and now we have the law school down here,
uh,
and also so many hospitals are in the area too,
and we have the Mayo,
uh,
Mayo Clinic partnership.
And,
and then also just having so many museums and
theater venues,
uh,
music venues,
restaurants,
I mean,
it's all so tightly knit and close,
and here you can really walk to
pretty much all those places from here,
which I think is not,
um,
things are not quite as accessible.
Um,
I mean,
they're certainly accessible from other campuses,
but it's just,
it's super convenient and embedded,
I think,
in comparison.
campuses.
So,
Barrett has this this goal to cultivate global citizenship.
How do you explore that in your courses and
then integrate that into your life as a teacher?
Um,
yeah,
good question.
So,
I mean,
I,
I really certainly keep that in mind and
Designing,
uh,
the syllabus,
as do I think all the Barrett faculty,
want to make sure we include voices
from all over the world,
uh,
when we're constructing,
constructing our classes and not focusing just on
kind of the,
the old white Western man.
Which
is kind of the
academic canon.
So,
so that's certainly,
I think,
yeah,
what I do in my classes,
but also,
um,
per like another project I want to work on.
So,
you know,
there's so many projects.
Uh,
is that,
oh well,
I mean,
of course,
I'm participating in this,
uh,
study abroad this coming summer,
but I'm hoping to,
uh,
design,
uh,
a new study abroad to Mexico City.
I still need to look into this.
This is,
I literally pretty much just have the idea that I want to go to Mexico City.
I don't know what that looks like yet,
but
I'd certainly want to,
um,
Uh,
kind of,
uh,
that,
that's another project I want to,
uh,
to work on to
kind of integrate
this idea of very little global citizenship
in,
in the college,
and yeah,
I don't think we,
yeah,
we don't have a,
a lot of our trips,
uh,
often do go to European destinations.
Of course,
we have other destinations too,
but I'd like to
get a look more into.
Uh,
to Mexico,
I mean,
it's right,
it's right here,
so,
uh,
well,
I mean,
Mexico City is a bit further,
but,
um,
I think that would be a great opportunity for students to,
to learn about places that
That we're not so so far away and that we have a,
a,
you know,
a pretty close relationship with.
Now this is a pretty lofty question,
but why isn't Barrett important to you?
Oh
God,
why is it important?
I mean,
so many reasons.
I mean,
I really,
yeah,
I really like how.
Uh,
Brick focuses on
the student,
the,
the student experience and student success,
and so that provides opportunities to
Uh,
you know,
work with students on amazing projects and,
uh,
get the opportunity to watch them,
them grow academically,
and I mean,
having these,
uh,
amazingly high standards for honors education,
I think being in a place where we can really
have the freedom to push students to really do the best that they can,
uh,
is,
is fantastic.
Um,
Yeah.
I'm not sure if I quite answered that adequately,
but
no,
I,
I think you did a really great job with that question.
So that that brings me to my next question is,
how do you think your background helps you teach
the human event?
Um.
This is more of an opinion
question,
yeah,
I know later on in the.
Oh,
OK.
Oh,
what,
what was it prepared me,
or yeah,
like how,
how does it make you qualified and what your background?
Yeah,
so,
well,
so I,
well,
I guess it
as of this year I've been teaching for,
I've been teaching critical thinking and argumentative
writing for about 14 years now,
so I was teaching,
I had been teaching that for about 10 years.
Uh,
before starting at Barrett.
So,
and,
and as I was mentioning,
I think critical thinking is really what the human event,
it,
uh,
is all about developing those critical thinking skills
that,
I mean,
that's really what my training is in,
uh,
specifically in,
of course,
my background is in philosophy,
and so that's a certainly a core subject that,
that comes up in the human events.
So I think that's certainly,
certainly helpful,
uh,
in
my,
you know,
uh,
being qualified to,
to teach it.
And
I think,
um,
I think,
well,
I might be biased as I am a philosophy person,
but I think philosophy is
particularly
useful in the human event in developing
those critical thinking skills and argumentative skills as
it is so,
I mean,
philosophy is really all about arguments.
I think there's like a lot of misconceptions about what philosophy is,
like people,
when people ask the question,
like,
what is your philosophy?
I don't really that that doesn't like.
Connect with me because
to me philosophy isn't just like having a theory about something.
It's really,
uh,
and people are often thinking about,
well,
what's your theory about life or something that's usually
kind of what the question is getting at,
but it's not,
but those questions often really aren't based on anything.
It's like,
well,
I just think this,
but that's not what.
Philosophy is it's all about
having
theories based upon rigorous arguments.
And since it's all about rigorous arguments,
I think that
quite well prepared me to teach the human event.
I mean,
I've even taught
logic in the past too,
which I mean,
that really,
I mean,
we don't,
of course,
want to do that in the human event,
that would like really be
drilling down like what we're doing.
We're really,
I mean.
I might argue that we are doing logic in the human event,
just not formally,
just informally.
So,
so I think,
yeah,
I've been prepared in that in those ways.
So based on,
on your emphasis on
forming strong critical thinkers,
what do you think makes a strong critical thinker?
How would you define a person that has those qualities?
I should write a paper on that I'd have to think about.
Um,
yeah,
that's tough.
Well,
I guess as I was mentioning before,
uh,
I think
a strong critical thinker really questions everything
and doesn't take anything at face value.
Looks for,
for evidence for claims,
uh,
analyzes claims,
kind of tries to look at things from different angles in different ways,
and,
uh,
tries to,
yeah,
come up with creative solutions to problems,
kind of thinking,
thinking outside the box.
I guess that.
Might be roughly,
I'd,
I'd want to say a lot more about that,
but that's all I can think of off the top of my head at the moment.
What has been the feedback you've gotten from past
students about human events or even your current students?
Are you
able to share some things that,
yeah,
I mean.
I know it,
it's,
it's a challenging course,
especially,
especially the essays.
I know,
uh,
I know the students are often,
uh,
challenged there,
but
in my experience that more often than not,
they
succeed,
they meet the challenge,
so I understand it's stressful,
uh,
but
I think they really,
they really grow a lot throughout the human event tremendously in different ways.
Um,
and yeah,
I think,
uh,
Yeah,
well,
I mean,
I did just have the last,
we did talk about some of this in my last day of class.
Uh,
they do,
uh,
they've liked that sometimes I pair videos with the texts and kind of analyze them,
analyze them together,
so they,
they certainly appreciate,
appreciate that.
Um,
I have it all written down on a piece of paper somewhere,
but,
uh,
but yeah,
and well,
and then the other,
uh.
I'm thinking about like history of ideas,
they,
uh,
yeah,
they really appreciated different perspectives,
uh,
put forth
in like like kind of
looking at various different social issues.
Uh,
and,
well,
actually thinking about history of ideas,
they said they appreciated that I wasn't trying to like tell them what to think,
that
I would interject every once in a while,
well,
what about this idea?
What about that idea?
But
they,
they said like,
and I very much appreciate that because that's my goal,
but,
uh,
yeah,
but,
um,
I
thankfully,
I guess,
uh.
I,
I think I achieved it,
so the students said I did this,
uh,
this year in that class anyway,
that,
you know,
I was good about letting them
kind of figure,
figure things out.
So now I'm going to move a little bit into the future.
So where do you see Barrett going in the next 5 to 10 years and beyond?
Um,
so I guess,
I mean,
yeah,
it's so hard to say,
but
I mean,
I think I see expanding further uh into our communities
and
forming,
uh,
forming more partnerships with whether it be businesses or institutions.
I think that's been kind of slowly
developing for,
for quite some time.
Uh,
and like,
like as I'm,
you know,
trying to develop relationships with,
um,
Various branches of the Department of Corrections for the Inside Out class,
uh,
that like that being one example,
but I know,
um,
certainly there's other examples of becoming more embedded,
embedded in the community,
um,
just even kind of using some of the venues out here for,
for events,
um,
you know,
things,
things like that.
So,
I guess.
Yeah,
it's so that is such a big question,
but.
I guess
I'm gonna,
and yourself,
where do you see yourself in 5 to 10 years?
Yeah,
oh boy,
yeah,
hopefully.
Yeah,
hopefully,
uh,
consistent,
I would say consistently.
Uh,
teaching,
uh,
facilitating an Inside Out class through Barrett's,
um,
working more with the Center for the Study of Race and Democracy,
uh,
and,
and
developing more partnerships and relationships with
the Department of Corrections to maybe
Uh,
find,
you know,
community solutions together and how we can just improve our overall community,
that would be,
I guess,
my hope.
For for the future,
is there a personal goal you have as related to your teaching for the next semester or
in relation to how you approach your classes that you'd like to share?
Um.
I mean,
I guess I kind of going back to what my students were saying,
you know,
when we were reflecting on class this semester is
really trying to find the perfect balance of.
Interjecting enough,
but not interjecting too much,
that's that's probably what I think about the most.
All the time,
so that's,
I think that's just always going to be a goal and trying to find that,
that,
um,
that perfect balance between,
yeah,
letting students develop all their own ideas,
uh,
but I mean,
but there needs to be some guidance there and just knowing exactly when
to,
to intervene and when not to.
Now,
do you have any other comments on Barrett that you'd like to say or anything
that we haven't covered
that you think any other projects that you're working on,
or?
You have anything as well?
Yeah,
I can't,
uh,
I can't think of anything off the top of my head.
I got,
I mean,
well,
I mean,
maybe I would say like I feel incredibly lucky to work here.
This is such a like.
So amazing.
Like
my colleagues are amazing,
uh,
yeah,
like everyone who works here is amazing,
the staff is amazing,
uh,
downtown,
we all work together so closely.
The students are amazing.
It's just,
it's a,
I,
I really lucked out in terms of,
you know,
where,
where I get to work.
It's a really supportive environment and
just really fun too.
I do have one question.
Um,
do you have any like favorite like funny memories or whatever
from one of your human event classes from this year?
I know in my own human event class,
like
I still remember some funny discussions about
realizing that a text was about two lesbian women and none
of us knew for like a good half an hour.
So like I was just curious,
like if you have any funny stories like that
of like human or like student realizations about anything or
just something that you liked seeing in a student.
Oh
gosh,
I mean,
there's so many like little ones,
but I'm trying to think like.
Huh,
let me stand out.
my gosh,
nothing's like
jumping.
Something
Oh,
I get,
well,
may like
might not be as good as your story,
but,
but like I think there was one story we read where,
yeah,
the ending is kind of ambiguous,
uh,
that maybe the
The two lovers,
like,
well,
one idea is that the two lovers just like went
off to an island and lived happily ever after,
and then someone else put forth a theory,
maybe they're dead,
or and
maybe like the,
the,
the symbolism is actually not literal,
and maybe this means they,
they're like dead and they
went to the afterlife.
They didn't go to an island,
they're,
they're dead.
Or,
and then also there was the idea in that same story that maybe since
the ending is so ambiguous that maybe the whole thing was a dream.
And the story is virtually real,
but.
So that those were some like,
oh,
like,
wow moments for students.
Well,
I think that finalizes all of my questions.
OK,
great.
Thank you so much for your participation.
And then
I also wanted to provide this information to you is that
if you have any more thoughts to share later on,
please feel free to reach out over email to any one
of us or Rachel you've been contacting about the project.
Um,
and if you have any other questions,
you can also contact Vice Dean.
So,
all right,
we're finished up.
Thank you so much for your time and participation.
Of course,
of course.
It was so awesome.